[ozarks dave]

im reading a few of your posts dem, and i have to say the best shelter you can build in a survival situation is the one that keeps you warm and dry. try them all.

i can understand traveling light, but dont fool yourself. take what you need to survive, trying to go completly minimalist can get you dead. and quick. i get cheap tarps from cummins tools for 2 bucks for a 8x10. excellent for makeshift shelter. lean to, etc... as far as not carrying any cordage, thats just plain ignorant IMO. 50 ft of paracord can go a LOOOOONG way, is reusuable, and weighs next to nothing. i can not imagine going camping/hiking/fishing/hunting/anything outdoors without having at the very least of 25' of paracord in my pocket. and my knife on my belt.

as far as leaving my backpack stored/stashed and not being able to find it in the dark, wouldnt happen. never leave your supplies unless life and death situation and you cant take them. my firesteel/scraper ride in a small leather pouch i made in my pocket. it holds my armageddon steel, super scraper, and a peice of fatwood. to go without the ability to make fire is more than ignorant my friend. its just plain deadly when in the elements. as an afterthought i know you are trying to conserve weight and space while hiking/climbing etc... but heres an idea. get a small shoulder bag, they have them at walmart right now for 8 bucks and made by remington, and put in a 8x10 tarp, 50ft of paracord, space blanket, firestarting equipment, a flashlight, spare batteries, knife, and maybe a stainless steel cup. i carry a kit similar to this, and if im going on a simple dayhike or dayout expedition, i have this slung over my shoulder riding on my back. i have everything i need to survive for a couple days. small fishing kit, few first aid items, tylenol ibuprofen and anti diareah pills(about 10 of each. and a leatherman juice mini multitool.

i know you want to go light but remember, without fire/water/shelter you are a dead man walking.

[Democracyman]

I am working toward that direction in the lightest way possible.

Instead of para cord I will find something lighter. Instead of a separate
pouch I will sew into my climbing jacket a built in back pack. What you
do is put a pouch in the back of your jacket with a Zipper. In use your
reach around your back with one had and unzip it and pull out the things
you need or want.

It is kind of hard to describe, but you take a section of fabric maybe 12 by
12 inches and sew that in to the jacket on the inside, put in a vertical zipper
on one side, the zipper on the outside of the jacket. Your able to reach around
and access it with one hand.

I plan to get a small stainless steel water bottle with a wide mouth. Size
to fit in a jacket pocket easily.

I should get the whole basic kit in, as you describe.

In climbing it is common to drop a pack and go to the summit, or go
to the summit with the least amount of gear while leaving camp behind.

My whole lightest in jacket kit should weigh about a pound or a little over, but not much.





Dan

[Democracyman]

My basic kit to date, I have two ways to make fire, one with a lighter with chap
stick and piece of foil rubber banded together and the other way with fire
steel with cotton saturated with Vaseline and candle wax, learned
that on the forum. I got a 9 X 8 foot plastic painter's drop cloth, I unfolded
it and took duct tape put a piece of duct tape about every 27 inches. Took
a hand held paper puncher and make "grommet" holes in the duct tape. I tested
these grommets and they are strong enough for what I am doing. I got one
39 gal trash bag, primarily for a door in a shelter. I got one campmor brand
space blanket. Need to pick up some uber light cord.

Anyway the whole kit to date with a Leatherman Wave tool weighs 1lb 4.5oz
The leatherman weighs 8.2oz so I could save around 4oz with a lighter knife
and get right in my limit of one pound. Not bad.

Wonder if I should throw in another garbage bag or not?

Dan

[tenderfoot]

cut down a pine tree (so it is on its side but not all the way on the ground ie still half attached to the stump) and then cut out the branches on the bottom till you fit inside the cavity and line with an emergency blanket. nice and warm and cozy. easy to if you have a good sized axe. you may even be able to fit a buddy.

[Democracyman]

cut down a pine tree (so it is on its side but not all the way on the ground ie still half attached to the stump) and then cut out the branches on the bottom till you fit inside the cavity and line with an emergency blanket. nice and warm and cozy. easy to if you have a good sized axe. you may even be able to fit a buddy.

I have not thought of cutting down a tree to make a shelter, I knew about
finding a downed tree to make a shelter.

I wonder what method, to use to select the best sized or type of tree
to cut down and what height to cut at? I guess you would want the thick
boughs to start high and then go low? I have a cold steel shovel so
I could cut down a tree fairly quickly.

What would be really neat is to make your fire bed FIRST then cut down
the tree over this. If the tree is not too big you could move into place if
off position when it fell.

Dan

[Celticwarrior]

Originally Posted by tenderfoot

cut down a pine tree (so it is on its side but not all the way on the ground ie still half attached to the stump) and then cut out the branches on the bottom till you fit inside the cavity and line with an emergency blanket. nice and warm and cozy. easy to if you have a good sized axe. you may even be able to fit a buddy.

I would really worry about the security of a freshly cut tree landing in a way that allowed it to stay partially hung, thus creating the cavity you speak of. It would be my fear that such a tree might shift in wind or just from stress on whatever it landed on, and come crushing down on me in the middle of the night. At least a blow-down that has been there a while is probably more secure and has shifted all it is likely to do before you started messing with it to finish it as shelter. I have a real aversion to taking shelter under any trees that might come down, either whole or in parts, and try very hard to avoid that situation when building lean-to's and such.

[COWBOYSURVIVAL]

Originally Posted by Celticwarrior

I would really worry about the security of a freshly cut tree landing in a way that allowed it to stay partially hung, thus creating the cavity you speak of. It would be my fear that such a tree might shift in wind or just from stress on whatever it landed on, and come crushing down on me in the middle of the night. At least a blow-down that has been there a while is probably more secure and has shifted all it is likely to do before you started messing with it to finish it as shelter. I have a real aversion to taking shelter under any trees that might come down, either whole or in parts, and try very hard to avoid that situation when building lean-to's and such.

I agree with you with a large enough tree to hurt me. Take it back a stepp and use a bushman or a hatchet on a 3" tree, cutting 1/2 way through and pulling over and anchoring would do great for shelter! I could see a 5" tree if it were a little iffy weather. I am gonna give it a try when I get finished with my hatchet and setup my BOB for just such a test.

[kevin]

Originally Posted by COWBOYSURVIVAL

. I am gonna give it a try when I get finished with my hatchet and setup my BOB for just such a test.

well don't forget about the horse shelter, I'm waiting for the pictoral of construction

[crazydave]

Originally Posted by Celticwarrior

I would really worry about the security of a freshly cut tree landing in a way that allowed it to stay partially hung, thus creating the cavity you speak of. It would be my fear that such a tree might shift in wind or just from stress on whatever it landed on, and come crushing down on me in the middle of the night. At least a blow-down that has been there a while is probably more secure and has shifted all it is likely to do before you started messing with it to finish it as shelter. I have a real aversion to taking shelter under any trees that might come down, either whole or in parts, and try very hard to avoid that situation when building lean-to's and such.

from my experiences downed trees which have been toppled with the root ball make excellent shelters from small pines to big birch you can just scoot on under there, if they fell with the prevailing wind then you have an automatic wind break and if any more are likely to go then you at least have some form of top cover. one site I go to hasnt been maintained very well, a lot of the trees are past their best and last time we had four snap off mid height but fortunately away from where we had the tents set up.

[COWBOYSURVIVAL]

Originally Posted by kevin

well don't forget about the horse shelter, I'm waiting for the pictoral of construction

I didn't forget, rather a necessity but we had some serious rain and now I have the swine flu.....I did test a shovel for stripping the bark today and remembered I broke the handle on my flat blade shovel, will have to rehandle it first but promise an update soon!